Thread "Randal's Manga-thon" in forum "Comic Talk and General Discussion *"

Posted at 4:01AM, Jan. 12, 2006

MISLEADING TITLE'D

I was hoping to try my hand at drawing giant robot battles and bad translations and stuff. You should change it to like Randal's 'Thon of No Manga. Or THE ANTIMANGATRON.

Disturb brings up something I wanted to address. These contests are going to be a quarterly event if the results are favorable, I don't have enough books to make that the prize all the time, but there will be prizes and they will be good. Next round will have three contests… People that don't do sprites (or do) that do sprite comics that aren't fanboy leet… People that don't do manga (or do) making compelling stories within the confines of what can be considered manga without driving stereotypes into the ground… and last but not least, a contest only for people who make manga and sprite comics to make good compelling non manga or sprite comics… there will be eight to ten weeks to come up with ten pages for each contest, then two to four weeks of showcasing, judging, awarding, and preparing for the next round.

Posted at 11:01AM, Jan. 12, 2006

MISLEADING TITLE'D

I was hoping to try my hand at drawing giant robot battles and bad translations and stuff. You should change it to like Randal's 'Thon of No Manga. Or THE ANTIMANGATRON.

or how about " The Super Hyper Mega Anti-Manga Reversal-a-thon"?

:)

Posted at 3:01PM, Jan. 12, 2006

First Define Manga. Because the Japanese definition is not what you think it is. 'Manga' means uncontrollable drawings. the word Manga is reserved for a special class of comics in Japan. Basically the origional, non formulaic stories are called 'manga'. Other comics are called shojoai, shonenai, doujinshi, ecchi,, hentai and a variety of other words that basically classify the comic in question. By way of example, Miazaki, Dunn and Takahashi are manga artists. Clamp are not.

In adition, despite the opinions stated by more than one in this very thread, many artists in many countries, including America (Chris Clarmont, Ben Dunn and Fred Perry), france and spain have been accepted as Manga by the japanese community. Even so, the very definition of Manga is brderless, not recognizing political boundries, even if the Japanese themselves are xenophobic.

Is your definition of Manga art that is inspired by japanese comics? If that is the case then there is a problem due to many of the non 'big eyes small mouth' professional comic artists here that were inspired by japanese comic artists. Fun fact: There are many comics in japan that are NOT the 'big eyes, small mouth' style, yet are called manga.

Is your definition of manga anything that has the big eyes small mouth stylization? Better call warner bros. or disney.

Is your definition of Manga anything from Japan? Well Most of the modern animation in america is done in japan like the TMNT cartoons, are they manga? Also does that exclude the 'anime' that is doen in taiwan or korea or china?

You have chosen to judge those of us who use this style based on fanbois with no lives imitating anything they can to feel special. That's not dissimilar to judging Star Wars by the bad costume players or judging Drunk Duck based on the gay jokes in some of the sprite comics.

I accept your challange, out of respect to thic comic hosting site, d the people (like spang) who take the time to help me when I make bone headed mistakes. But at it's core I think this kind of thing is demeaning.

P.S. Randall, your avitar bears a striking resemblance to one of the characters depicted in a 4 panel mini comic run in the japanese issues of Shonen Jump, circa 1992.

Posted at 8:01PM, Jan. 12, 2006

Owned.

Hmm…not really! I think she was just trying to make a point.

I think this should be a challenge for anyone. :D That's why I wanted to join, but I haven't been given a yes or anything so I don't know if I can.

Posted at 8:01PM, Jan. 12, 2006

I know I'd like to make an attempt at doing a manga, to see how "the otherside lives". :P

Posted at 5:01AM, Jan. 13, 2006

I made it quite clear as to who can enter this contest, Jydra. And no, most american cartoons aren't specifically made in Japan. Most American cartoons are predominantly made in many places in the orient, a large portion of them coming from Korea. Though, with Flash and other programs like it, I've noticed a lot of 2D shows that are being 100% done on the computer over here in North America.

As for the Manga style, Wikipedia covers a lot of ground, but I'm not sure it touches on manga-inspired web-comics. I've already covered who is elegible for this contest.

As for who qualifies for this contest, anybody who does a manga comic, or feel they don't but have been told they do. Do what Mazoo hit on and try anything but what you are doing now.

To answer those of you who don't do manga but want to do a ten paged manga themed comic, go ahead and do that, I'll see if Chuck or somebody can donate a third DDvol1 as a prize. If you want to win that contest, throwing something together that basically just makes fun of manga story conventions or manga-inspired web-comics won't do it for you. They need to be just as well thought out and planned as some of the stuff I'm already seeing come back for the Sprite contest.

To all you cerebral Manga fans reading this thread and getting ready to put your insult on… I'm not doing these contests because I hate Sprites or Manga. I'll read a story using just about any visuals, as long as the story's good. A while back a lot of people slammed a guy who goes by the name Breezy for his art on his earliest comics, totally dismissing that a couple of them were the best written stories ever to grace Drunk Duck.
Before McLintock! there was Nimrod and later Beck. The art was rudimentary, but the stories were brilliant.

As for my avatar… it comes from the latest incarnation of my comic's title character, Gene.

Posted at 4:01PM, Jan. 13, 2006

The problem herin is that you don't give any paramiters whatsoever, and no definition of what you concider to be 'manga' other than 'Don't do what you're doing now'.

Ok so that means I can take screenshots of anime games and make a ten page string of fart jokes in japanese?

That would be pretty much the exact opposite of what I'm doing now, yet I think that would fall into your definition of 'manga'.

See, I'm not accusing you of being a manga hater. I know better. But you have created a hostile environment for those DD artists who choose the japanesque medium by challenging us to do somthing 'different' but with no parameters. I'm not a big rules person but you've left us in a position where litterally anything we submit can be disqualified or whatever because litterally anything can be used as a parallel to a japanese comic.

It's the same thing with your sprite contest. I mean, chances are, if they were comfortable with their drawing ability, they prolly wouldn't be doing sprites, so you're basically slamming them with a contest like this completely invalidation their stories (some of which are really good) by implying that if they were a real artist they could expand outside of their medium.

Now I don't believe you intended it to come off this way, but it did. Please put some parameters on it other than "do somthing different". Try making this a contest that would be fun to participate in rather than somthing japanesque artists feel a need to participate in to defend themselves.

Give us a definition. What do you consider 'manga'? 'Cause we can turn in comics that are very different from what were doing nowand it could still be called manga.

P.S. Yes I know where your duck comes from. I just wanted to make the point especially clear that literally any art can be connected to manga, just like any actor can be connected to Kevin Bacon. I ment no offence, I'm sorry.

P.P.S Wikipedia is a great site, but that entry contains several erroneous entries. It's a fantastic online encyclopedia, but it's entries are written by regular people as opposed to researchers and professors, and as such are prone to certain common errors. You, me, anybody can write a Wikipedia entry. If the Wikipedia entry is your definenition of 'manga' then please make that clear.

Posted at 8:01PM, Jan. 13, 2006

Give us a definition. What do you consider 'manga'? 'Cause we can turn in comics that are very different from what were doing nowand it could still be called manga.

Well, I think he means that the everyday Joe Schmoe on the street can look at the finished product and not think, "Oh, that's Japanese." There's some grey area in there, but if you have to parse the definition of manga too fine, then your comic won't be non-manga enough.

Keep up this contest, Randal, despite cries of outrage from detractors.

~IJ

Posted at 11:01PM, Jan. 13, 2006

despite cries of outrage from detractors.

I don't think its outrage so much as " could you be more specific."

There is a lot of concern about being eliminated on a technicality or perhaps misconception. Challenging us 'manga copycats' to contest to draw something other than manga is fine. We just want some clarification on what we can and can't do.

Is that really so wrong to ask?

Posted at 1:01AM, Jan. 14, 2006

Give us a definition. What do you consider 'manga'? 'Cause we can turn in comics that are very different from what were doing nowand it could still be called manga.

Well, I think he means that the everyday Joe Schmoe on the street can look at the finished product and not think, "Oh, that's Japanese." There's some grey area in there, but if you have to parse the definition of manga too fine, then your comic won't be non-manga enough.

Keep up this contest, Randal, despite cries of outrage from detractors.

~IJ

I agree, Ian, some people are taking this way too literal and way too serious. I particularly picked the Wikipedia definition, because it IS written by Joe Average. Not experts who can disect every line.

Here, however, are a few guidelines; Over the years, manga styled comics have developed a distinct set of symbolic conventions, the same way over here you'd see a lightbulb over a characters head if they suddenly developed an idea. First is the standard character design. It's true, not all manga has giganic glossy eyes, but they are a standard. Not every manga uses chibi, but it's a standard. Not every manga uses the little emoticons, like the raised vein on the forehead or the giant tear, but they are standards. The same can be said of extended legs, simplified upturned noses, hair that is dramatically clumped together instead of handled more freely and by the strand.

Story conventions that are considered manga are a little more ambiguous, but there are a few that can be singled out. The effeminate moody male lead. the caring yet loud short tempered girl. overt sexual undertones, small magical creatures… agian, these arent' in every manga, but they are common. I'm sure you can come up with more standards than I can. I'm not above asking someone to assist in coming up with more to post in this thread… You could even help with the guidelines for this and future versions of these contests.

Posted at 1:01AM, Jan. 14, 2006

Thankyou.

As for outcry… I'm sorry if I'm touchy on the subject.

I've been developing my style for 16 years. In that time it's gone from people in school taking my drawing pad and tearing it up, and kicking me around because "Why can't you draw like normal" all the way to people looking at my work and scoffing and calling me a poser.

So maybe I am touchy but holy moly, can't there just be a middleground?

SO I apologise for my touchyness, but from where I sit these contests really do look like an excuse to bash the respective mediums. I DO realise that's not the case. It just looks that way.

On a lighter note, I realized somthing today. I'm not doing this contest just out of respect for the Duck, but also for me. If I can't step out of my medium I don't deserve to call myself an artist.

So next question, when we finish it where do we put it?

Posted at 2:01AM, Jan. 14, 2006

I realize people have their own schedules to maintain, and comicing in your own style takes a while, let alone branching out into undiscovered territory. So from the start date of this thread, add ten weeks, (a week per page. though you need to get cracking now as about a week has gone by.)

you announce your participation by saying so in this thread. On the first page, aside from not having the ruled out conventions (listed above, more may be added) the rest of the information is in the first post in this thread.

Somewhere, probably the first post, i'll keep a running tally of who has said they'll participate. let me know if I forget you.

As for where to put them when you're done… add it as a new comic under your account, then link it here in the thread.

Posted at 12:01PM, Jan. 14, 2006

Koo. I'm in.

Posted at 12:01AM, Jan. 24, 2006

In the end, there's no sense in arguing. Going beyond your artistic comfort zone only creates good things in the end.

I'm in, as well.

Well said, KC3T LV. The whole reason for this is just what you said, it only creates good things in the end.

I will add the two of you to the list.

Posted at 11:01PM, Jan. 24, 2006

*skritches head* Man… I really want to play… but I don't think anyone has ever told me my comic was Japanese comic-like. Can I play if I just make another comic that's also not Japanese comic-like but a far cry from my Tenniel/Rackham style?

((Sorry if you answered this, I tried to find the answer, but came up with nothin'. Oh… and this is my comic ==> http://www.drunkduck.com/Fated_Feather/ Maybe it is manga-esque?))

Posted at 11:01AM, Jan. 25, 2006

*skritches head* Man… I really want to play… but I don't think anyone has ever told me my comic was Japanese comic-like. Can I play if I just make another comic that's also not Japanese comic-like but a far cry from my Tenniel/Rackham style?

((Sorry if you answered this, I tried to find the answer, but came up with nothin'. Oh… and this is my comic ==> http://www.drunkduck.com/Fated_Feather/ Maybe it is manga-esque?))

sorry, this particular contest is strictly open to manga or manga-ish comic creators only. but there will be another contest in a few months where non-manga types can compete to make their own ten page manga style comic. as well as this contest renewed, manga types doing non-manga comics

Posted at 12:02PM, Feb. 6, 2006

I am so up for that comic.

The main character will be a 14 year old boy named "WAI".

And when the kid does somthing bad, all the people will be like,

"Why Wai? WHY?"

Won't that be fun?

Posted at 12:02PM, Feb. 6, 2006

GWAHAHAHA HIS NAME IS WAI! HAHAHA! HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! OH EGGBERT YOU AND YOU SHINANIGANS!

MAY THE WORLD FLING YOU INTO ORBIT WITH A HOT MODEL NAMED BEYROUTH!

Posted at 4:02PM, Feb. 7, 2006

I know this was started a while ago, but I'd really like to give this a try. My stuff is DEFINATELY manga style (manga is really my only comic influence) and I think doing something outside my comfort zone would be a good test of my abilities (or lack thereof).

So…can I still be in it? I'm willing to grovel, I'm not too proud.

Posted at 11:02PM, Feb. 8, 2006

Isn't manga or non-manga comparison debate been "over-debated"? =_=

I think it's better to say Japanese influenced or non Japanese influenced, instead of manga or non manga styled.

Posted at 11:02AM, Feb. 9, 2006

Chrono, welcome aboard!
Chris-Chris, as it's been stated, if you've been called manga influenced, go for anything that doesn't contain the japanese/manga cliches.
Eunice, it's a contest, not a debate.

Read through this forum thread, chris chris, many people have described what manga is in here. I know it's getting harder to draw lines these days, as even Teen Titans is using chibi and manga/anime emoticons in that show, but it's not impossible.

Posted at 1:02PM, Feb. 9, 2006

I think, despite my original misgivings, I'm going to give this a go. I've been kicking around a short story in my head that might actually work.

Drawing manga is completely by choice for me. Its more like stretching some lazy muscles than moving out of a comfort zone. But hey, I could use one. ( a stretch that is.) Remind myself of some of my older stylistic whims.

Count me in.

Posted at 10:02PM, Feb. 10, 2006

The official due date is March 18th, 2006…

It'll be here sooner than you think.

Posted at 10:02PM, Feb. 16, 2006

-_-

I'd actually like to see you, out of all people, entering this.

My drawing style can go from simplistic manga style to semi realism manga. I could try out this contest but I might have difficulty "westernizing" storylines since I'm heavily exposed by manga and asian culture.

Oh, what the heck. Count me in. I think I can produce 1 to 2 pages. One of the art styles I guess I'm comfortable with is probably the "Jimmy Neutron" style. But my storyline and dialogues might probably fail to meet the non manga standards.

Posted at 1:02PM, Feb. 23, 2006

Some people call my stuff Manga is it? The world may never know! :shock: