Kline, I accidentally deleted your post. It wasn't a conspiracy, I'm not used to the buttons yet. I was trying to quote it…
Fortunately, kingofsnake quoted it in full.
Anyway, I just wanted to respond that those who feel DD is not what it was, or that it has now become something they don't like are free to go (like always). I hope that even if they remove their comic they'll continue to be a part of our forum participants.
…and then kingofsnake said a lot of what I was going to say. DD was a website, not a public park. It was owned by an individual, now a company. That's not the worst thing in the world and can be even better since Dylan still controls the programming.
One thing I disagree with SpANG on is that I don't think Dylan would ever turn his back on the community no matter what the cost, or how loudly a few people complained. The majority of the DD community has shown that they're all right with this change(or at least willing to see what happens). There are a few who are unhappy, and there always are - every time DD changes, we lose a few and gain a lot. Check out the hello section if you don't believe me.
Financial considerations aside, I believe he sold it to Platinum - and now works for them - because he thinks it's the best cours for DD and himself.
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Comic Talk and General Discussion *
To those leaving: Why?
No, problem, Ronson.
In response to some of the other responses, all rude aspersions aside, one of my own problems is the disconnect between the assurances that this is a "friendly community, they're great guys, they're comic fans like us" one moment to encourage participation and the evocation of MSN and Google and "it's just business" the next. I realize this is a business and that Platinum and Volte are here to make a profit. They are looking out for themselves and by asking questions and presenting criticism I am looking out for myself, as all parties should. And indeed, as criticism arises, DD has continued to offer clarifications which can only be a good thing. I'm about 80/20 on ever putting something on DD right now and you can be sure that all the condescending insults in the world are not going to keep me from doing my best to take my time and look critically at the situation. It is hypocritical to accuse me of not bothering to look at the all the information and then insult me when I speak out about something I may have a concern with or attempting a dialogue on a thread intended to discuss these criticisms.
According to the NY times article DD was something that Volte was doing in his "spare time" and not as full time work. I believe that partcipants had no problem with ad revenue going to him or being used to pay for the site. It is the leveraging of their content for sale to a corporation for full commercialization that they had a problem with.
And yes, I did go ahead and buy some private hosting for myself. But thanks for the tip.
According to the NY times article DD was something that Volte was doing in his "spare time" and not as full time work. I believe that partcipants had no problem with ad revenue going to him or being used to pay for the site. It is the leveraging of their content for sale to a corporation for full commercialization that they had a problem with.
I understand that, and I think that's the only valid difference between the way it was a few months ago and today. But it isn't their content that was for sale. It was the system they used. If that weren't the case, people wouldn't have the option to leave and they do.
I think it's somewhat disengenous to pretend that other sites aren't thinking toward profit and aren't giving money to a corporation at some point. Hosting is mostly done by corporations, the only difference is that you give the money to them instead of them running ads on your site. That is, you pay directly for the service.
But the full control and ownership an artist has to do what they please with their art is something I strongly believe in. For me, DD hasn't changed in a significant enough way - or in an even slightly negative way - for me to consider leaving.
But it is all perception. Anyone uncomfortable should weight the issues before you and make your choices. And there is no wrong answer. I am sure the majority will stay with DD, and that some will leave. But the door is always open for them to return.
It is hypocritical to accuse me of not bothering to look at the all the information and then insult me when I speak out about something I may have a concern with or attempting a dialogue on a thread intended to discuss these criticisms.
I'm sorry if my newspost came off as aggressive, I didn't mean for it to be insulting. Perhaps I simply misinterpreted your newspost. Drunk duck is both a business and a community, in fact it's in the business of being a community, So really both positions have strong arguments for their sides. But just because DD is a business doesn't make it anyless a community and visa versa. In fact the community is the reason I started to post my comic on DD.
In reality it is unlikely that PS will see a lot of direct profits from DD, the benifit they'll have from DD is as a forum to drum up interest in their comic projects, and as a bridge for taleted writers and artists to connect with the professional comic world, that otherwise would have no idea how to get themselves noticed.
But the thought that the reason someone might leave, is "I helped make this community great, now the community is making money, wheres my cut?" is fundamentally flawed. It'd be like telling your friend about this awesome band, your friend going out and buying the CD and then you writing a letter to the band looking for a finders fee.
The only difference in policy thus far is that any profit is going into PS now insted of Dylan, and they just shelled out bucks for this massive upgrade, so I'm betting they're going to have a little while to go before they're in the black
I think you both make good points here. I suppose the difference in hosting options is transparancy really.
With the band anology, I think the difference is that if a band were to bring performers into a bar wouldn't they expect compensation? Sure they are given a platform for self-promotion but they are also providing an asset to the bar owner. That doesn't mean the owner needs to consult them in his business dealings, of course. Maybe that's a terrible example..Have fun poking holes in that one ;). Speaking for my own self-interest it does bother me when I see fellow creators seemingly under-valuing what they bring to the table even if this does turn out to be a fair deal.
And just to make things clear, I do not wish to shortchange the hard work that Dylan put into this site or not give credit for the improvements that have been made. As I said before, I do hope things work out to the satisfaction of everyone whether they are staying or leaving.
One step up on the metahpor.
It's like a battle of the bands. The guy holding the battle of the bands doesn't charge them to participate, and they don't make any money from the show, but they get a wider spectrum of people to listen to their music, they get to meet other bands and maybe, if they're truly awesome they can win a shiney trophy. And who knows, there might be a record exec in the crowd that digs their tune.
personally, i'll do what i've always done. keep my story alive and update. i don't really wanna be bothered with webcomic politcs. I don't do my comic for money and if some corporation want to pay me a ceratin percentage to merchandise something I do for a hobby, its good. It's not like I was geting payed before.
personally, i'll do what i've always done. keep my story alive and update. i don't really wanna be bothered with webcomic politcs. I don't do my comic for money and if some corporation want to pay me a ceratin percentage to merchandise something I do for a hobby, its good. It's not like I was geting payed before.
Amen. no webcomic politics for me, either. I got into this because i decided to do something with all those ideas working in discount retail gave me, not because i feel the need to make a statement about pixel-pictures.
Corvin
From what I gather, a lot of people are leaving because they feel that the community aspect is going to be lost. That the community would get overrun by the comics that are being paid to be up (or it seems like they are being paid to be put up) and that the little guy will get swarmed.
Now it's easy to think that when you hear how about 100 comics are going to be hosted up on to DD because they are Platinum Studio's comics. So the appearance is that "who cares about the little guy, these guys paid" which despite not being true, it's hard to think of it as false.
So it comes to a "I can't compete with the big guys" kidna mentality, and it's hard to get past that.
From what I gather, a lot of people are leaving because they feel that the community aspect is going to be lost. That the community would get overrun by the comics that are being paid to be up (or it seems like they are being paid to be put up) and that the little guy will get swarmed.
Now it's easy to think that when you hear how about 100 comics are going to be hosted up on to DD because they are Platinum Studio's comics. So the appearance is that "who cares about the little guy, these guys paid" which despite not being true, it's hard to think of it as false.
So it comes to a "I can't compete with the big guys" kidna mentality, and it's hard to get past that.
Well Cowboys and Aliens has been on DD a couple days now… feel demoralized yet? You probably didn't even realize it was here.
From what I gather, a lot of people are leaving because they feel that the community aspect is going to be lost. That the community would get overrun by the comics that are being paid to be up (or it seems like they are being paid to be put up) and that the little guy will get swarmed.
Now it's easy to think that when you hear how about 100 comics are going to be hosted up on to DD because they are Platinum Studio's comics. So the appearance is that "who cares about the little guy, these guys paid" which despite not being true, it's hard to think of it as false.
So it comes to a "I can't compete with the big guys" kidna mentality, and it's hard to get past that.
Well Cowboys and Aliens has been on DD a couple days now… feel demoralized yet? You probably didn't even realize it was here.
I did and i fell in love D:
From what I gather, a lot of people are leaving because they feel that the community aspect is going to be lost. That the community would get overrun by the comics that are being paid to be up (or it seems like they are being paid to be put up) and that the little guy will get swarmed.
I find that funny if that's the case. It's like abandoning your house because there *might* be a tornado coming in a week.
From what I gather, a lot of people are leaving because they feel that the community aspect is going to be lost. That the community would get overrun by the comics that are being paid to be up (or it seems like they are being paid to be put up) and that the little guy will get swarmed.
I find that funny if that's the case. It's like abandoning your house because there *might* be a tornado coming in a week.
I don't think stepping out of town for a few days if a tornado might be coming is overreacting at all. A tornado is a scary thing.
What I think it's more like is perhaps a party, or concert, or any gathering of people. Now, perhaps if you were going to this event since the "glory days" when your buddy Jeb held it in his basement when his parents were away for the weekend and now feel the whole thing has gone "totally corporate" now that he rents space in the civic center, then there's really no helping you. But if you're afraid to go because someone might be wearing the same clothes and looking better in them than you do, then you really need to re-prioritize your life.
From what I gather, a lot of people are leaving because they feel that the community aspect is going to be lost. That the community would get overrun by the comics that are being paid to be up (or it seems like they are being paid to be put up) and that the little guy will get swarmed.
I find that funny if that's the case. It's like abandoning your house because there *might* be a tornado coming in a week.
I don't think stepping out of town for a few days if a tornado might be coming is overreacting at all. A tornado is a scary thing.
What I think it's more like is perhaps a party, or concert, or any gathering of people. Now, perhaps if you were going to this event since the "glory days" when your buddy Jeb held it in his basement when his parents were away for the weekend and now feel the whole thing has gone "totally corporate" now that he rents space in the civic center, then there's really no helping you. But if you're afraid to go because someone might be wearing the same clothes and looking better in them than you do, then you really need to re-prioritize your life.
Yeah, I actually tried to go back and edit it to say "It's like abandoning your house because there *might* be a fire someday."
but after several attempts. I had to leave it as is.
Yeah, that makes a bit more sense, Spang. The problem, though, is that your analogies so far have had a real, earth-shattering threat on the horizon. There's really no risk of losing one's comics on this site (aside from a server crash, which is actually a lot less likely now that Plat has a vested interest in the site). The only real threats now are matters of popularity, or the loss of the "small-time" feel of the site.
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