Am I really the only person who thinks Disney animation is just plain dreadful?
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Comic Talk and General Discussion *
Walt Disney = Genius
Am I really the only person who thinks Disney animation is just plain dreadful?
No.
It's true that Walt didn't make the modern movies discussed here, but he didn't make the old ones either. He got some other guys to do it for him and made sure they got no recognition or fair recompense for their groundbreaking efforts.
Then he put his name all over their work.
When they raised their voices in complaint, the choice was simple. Do as Uncle Walt says, or he'll have you blacklisted as a communist and you won't be able to feed your family again.
He couldn't draw either.
Does that make him a genius?
Sadly, it would seem so.
Can Walt Disney draw?
Did he create those famous Disney animal characters?
Did he have a hands-on role in all the early animation shorts/films, either artistic or directorial?
And no, not everyone are racist just because they were born in 190x. What about the Abolitionists? The ppl who facilitated the underground railroad? The Caucasians who supported voting reforms?
As for age-appropriate content… I read the unsanitized Norse myths when I was in elementary school (hands were cut off, ppl were eaten by monsters, ppl were coveting other ppls' wives…). I also read The Little Match Girl and found out she dies on the next to last page. I also read (and watched) The Little Tin Soldier and found out they both died. I also read stories I can't recall where the witch cooked the brother and tried to feed him to his siblings (etc etc). I think children can handle (well-written) content just fine.
What I did not want to watch (as a kid) was Nightmare On Elm Street and Friday The 13th, etc. The tape box cover was enough to scare me away.
so we're all agreed then ? walt disney was a Monster !!!
Now we've dealt with that, let's credit a real genius. Max Fleischer was the first guy to put sound to animation, as well as inventing several other animation processes.
I'll take Betty Boop over Mickey Mouse any day and as for Popeye, that's genius with a capital G and a bumper bucket of 'enius!
Wow, who would've thought this post would be so heated! The irony here is that I didn't grow up watching Disney or watch it now for that matter, nor do I pretend to be knowledgable on Walt the man. I originally was just making a comment after being in Disney's Hollywood Studios and was amazed by what has stemmed from essentially a comic mouse. I probably should have named the topic 'Mouse = empire' or something like that, lol. Oh, well…
Walt Disney, the man himself, had a great work ethic and knew how to run a company, but also have imagination. A great book about him is "Walt Disney: The Triumph of the American Imagination" by Neal Gabler. I reccommend it highly.
…Unfortunately, as soon as Walt died, the great things about his company died with him, in my opinion. It's become a money-hungry corporation, nothing more. Michael Eisner was to blame for most of that. Eisner knew how to make money, and that's about it.
Disney the man, men, or company?
I sort of know what you mean. Whenever I watch a movie I used to love as a kid, I find that I appreciate it more as someone older. I no longer love it for the cute animals or pretty princesses, but for more substantial things like… art, plot, script, characters, and all the other little details. I realize how much work went into it and how much Disney tweaked it from the original story/history.
Man I still watch movies like The Hunchback of Notre Dame and The Lion King. But after reading The Hunchback of Notre Dame (and being left afterwards wanting to cry) I've felt that the book and movie should not be considered the same story.
Still, great movies. The disney movies these days (as well as the disney channel) need to be burned and allowed to end with some kind of honor.
On the topic of great kid's movies, I have to say that Pixar does the best stuff there is today. I also still watch Jim Henson movies (The Muppet Movie, A Muppet Christmas Carrol, Muppet treasure Island, etc).
Pixar uses the SAME male personalities for all it's main roles.
The; 'Generally a do-gooder, he gets himself into a sticky situation with his jealousy and pride. but with never ending perseverance, he comes through for his friends in the end and saves the day'.
Examples; woody from toy story, red car from cars, mr.incredible, nemo's dad, ratatouille, the rest of the pixar films.
I mean i enjoy the films, it's just when you realize all the roles do this it's hard not to role your eyes.
Pixar uses the SAME male personalities for all it's main roles.
The; 'Generally a do-gooder, he gets himself into a sticky situation with his jealousy and pride. but with never ending perseverance, he comes through for his friends in the end and saves the day'.
Examples; woody from toy story, red car from cars, mr.incredible, nemo's dad, ratatouille, the rest of the pixar films.
I mean i enjoy the films, it's just when you realize all the roles do this it's hard not to role your eyes.
I'll have to say I agree on this one. Ratatoullie's story is a dead give away too.
But that didn't stop me from loving the movie though. The animation is amazing. The wet fur, the water… everything. Pixar may be regenerating the same lead characters all over again but their effort in taking their art further will always charm me in a way Disney never had. Sure, I am greatly touched on how the old artists animated those old Disney movies painstakingly (without the convenience of computers and all) but somehow, it went downhill after Tarzan. Such a shame.
Oh, well.
*watches Futurama Movie: Bender's Big Score*
Walt Disney, the man himself, had a great work ethic and knew how to run a company, but also have imagination. A great book about him is "Walt Disney: The Triumph of the American Imagination" by Neal Gabler. I reccommend it highly.That book does touch on the points I made about him being a real bastard when it came to the animators strike in 1941, not only posting ARMED GUARDS to intimidate them, but fingering several of the Union heads as commies just to get rid of them.
"Ethical" is not the way many would describe his work.
Well, I don't really get the part about Disney "watering down" fairy tales. Are you guys talking just about the violence? Because besides that, it's not like the Perault or Grimm stories were very "deep" either…
Fun fact though: In the 1940s, some Americans called for a ban on fairy tales because they were popularized by the Brothers Grimm, who were German, and Germany = Nazis, so fairy tales obviously caused Nazi..ism. It was like some bastardized version of Six Degrees of Separation.
That book does touch on the points I made about him being a real bastard when it came to the animators strike in 1941, not only posting ARMED GUARDS to intimidate them, but fingering several of the Union heads as commies just to get rid of them.
"Ethical" is not the way many would describe his work.
I'm right behind you Spang; together we shall defeat the evil Disney empire.
FIRE UP THE MILLENIUM ROADRUNNER!
Walt Disney was an insane genius… an anti semetic one but a genius any way. He accomplished more in his short life then most of us will in our entire lives. He commissioned the plans for disney land and disney world and oversaw the building of Disney Land, I believe that he died during the building of Disney World though. He also started a billion dollar company from the ground up with a freakin mouse. Then became filthy rich turning old books like Bambi and the Jungle Book into block buster hits. Whether you hate the movies or not you probably wish you could have thought of it all first.
Wow, what a hilarious thread! I like how on the internet there's no middle ground or gray area. Something's either the "best thing ever" or the "worst possible thing in existence". Certainly Disney couldn't have several excellent movies like Lion King and Beauty and the Beast, and yet some poor ones like The Aristocats and Home on the Range. No, it has to be one end or the other.
I like Disney, and I think the world is better for the things it has contributed. I don't agree with everything Disney has done and I don't like everything Disney has created… But that's the nice thing about life. You can go see Aladdin but skip that silly Viva Chihuahua movie. Or I suppose you can sit on the internet and make blanket statements about an entire company based whichever movies support your opinion. Nobody questions the moral implications of Universal Studios or Dreamworks based off specific movies… they say "I liked this one" or "I don't like this one." I wonder what makes Disney different.
I think Disney's good overall and would like to see their animation reclaim the magic it has been missing lately. Of course I have a very obvious bias, so don't take me too seriously.
Wow, what a hilarious thread! I like how on the internet there's no middle ground or gray area. Something's either the "best thing ever" or the "worst possible thing in existence". Certainly Disney couldn't have several excellent movies like Lion King and Beauty and the Beast, and yet some poor ones like The Aristocats and Home on the Range. No, it has to be one end or the other.
A lot of those negative opinions were stemming from Walt's dubious record as an employer, not his second rate movies, like The Aristocats, which happens to be my favourite!
I think Disney's good overall and would like to see their animation reclaim the magic it has been missing lately. Of course I have a very obvious bias, so don't take me too seriously.
Of course we're going to take you seriously - you've got a hair dryer, cocked and ready to blow!
I think it's just the fact that Disney's so much of a larger company than DreamWorks and… is it larger than Universal? I dunno. I guess another part of it is the fact that Disney is very kid-centric, and for some unexplainable reason people like to be total assholes to the kid-centric media (Example: the false rumor that the original host of Blue's Clues died of an overdose, the claim that pretty much anyone who's ever had any involvement in kids' media is either a pedophile or on heavy drugs). I think they've put out some good stuff, obviously just about anything Pixar's made for example, and as an aside, regardless of what anyone has to say I think Emperor's New Groove was one of them.
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