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Is Wowio very set on "The Duck?" Maybe we could have a contest to come up with a new, family-friendly adjective so the community at least gets some input there.
Is Wowio very set on "The Duck?" Maybe we could have a contest to come up with a new, family-friendly adjective so the community at least gets some input there.Actually, originally Skool and I were asked to help with a new name, but try as we might we just couldn't think of anything better than what was chosen- you know, to fit in with the old name as well as NOT being the old name.
I don't see how we can report bugs when we're told than half the site isn't functional, but not what exactly is and isn't.
You're right, the Quack would have been worse (not much but a little). One word names suck. One word names with a "the" are worse. Heh. I kinda wish they'd just changed the "drunk" to a different "D" adjective because we are DDers, and it is DD. In fact, I rarely called it DrunkDuck, always DD. (We've never been "duckers" or whatever, no matter how many times some non-DDer tried to use that.) Yeah, it's minor, but it's still a stupid name. At least the old stupid name had catchy initials. I'm sticking to calling everything DD no matter what the banners say. I'll change the other "D" to different adjectives depending on my mood. ;) (It can be Dim, Daunting, Dreary, or Dormant Duck for now. If some good changes are made, perhaps it will become dazzling or dashing, at the very least distinguished – hopefully never detrimental or doomed.)
The issue of customization is the most important right now. I think it is wise to allow link exchanges and PW. It isn't just a matter of member privilege and advantage. That is the backbone of site traffic – especially for the top 100 sites. Some of them are excellent at marketing. Tying their hands will hurt DD traffic, and I wouldn't blame them for dropping DD as their host (at least their main host) if their readership drops. That kinda defeats the purpose of the DD ad placement to let the site support itself. You need traffic to make profit from ads.
Other customization options give individual comics their identities. Readers don't like to be reminded that they are viewing a "hosted" comic. Somehow it cheapens things for them and it gives comics a black mark. So custom graphics are important and having layout options is a good idea too. Even simple things such as which side to have comments are, option of comment box above or below comments, option of having navigation above or below the comic page image or both, etc. would be fantastic. Maybe port over some of the user-made layouts to act as templates.
One more note here in case the Wowio people read this thread. (If they do, kudos to them!) Everything is very TINY. I use bifocals. Small print and images make me sad. :( Can we have bigger print and avatars? I think they are quite lovely at 100 x 100 pixels or at least 80 x 80.
I guess all things will change, even names. But I'd still like to keep the "Drunk" in the name in honor of the duck that inspired the name of the site… My memory can be bad, but I think I read somewhere that the site creator's duck had died and he thought it looked kinda drunk or something…
I guess all things will change, even names. But I'd still like to keep the "Drunk" in the name in honor of the duck that inspired the name of the site… My memory can be bad, but I think I read somewhere that the site creator's duck had died and he thought it looked kinda drunk or something…They wanted to name the site after the resently deceased duck, but deadduck.com sounded really bad. drunkduck is comparitively better.
I have one foot out the door (like almost everyone else in the top 100)
Please don't throw in statements like this about other people that you can't possibly speak for, it reduces the strength of your argument. Stick to your own experience and don't try to enlarge your point by saying things you can't back up.
The Duck isn't a very nice name, as I suggested earlier though, The Webcomic Duck sounds marginally better.
But I like the idea of having DD still around, so that it will always be DD to everyone who's been around for a while.
Tim Wellman: If you want to leave then leave, no one's stopping you. Buh-bye now.
Tim Wellman: If you want to leave then leave, no one's stopping you. Buh-bye now.Sentences like that have doomed companies in the past, Bff (speaking from experience). Let's give Wowio themselves a chance to have their say on Wellman's statement before you speak on their behalf.
"Webcomic Duck"…
Webcomic Duck is a really bad name too. Might as well call the site Yolk From Egg. When you upload a comic it would say "YOLK FROM EGG" and depending on the inflection it would tell you whether it uploaded or failed.
I've actually already left… I won't be updating Time Girls anymore on DD.
What needs to be pointed out is this… Time Girls is rated #71 overall and #56 in Comic Books… sure, I'm one guy… but how many of us can WOWIO drive away before DrunkDuck/TheDuck becomes a site of only sprite and gradeschool stick figure comics. That's not going to get them any ad banner clicks… they need me and my other colleagues who draw comics that people actually come here to read. The webcomics themselves are the only reason anyone comes here… WOWIO doesn't understand that… they don't get that WE have THEIR economic future in our hands. They should be bending over backwards to please US… not shouting down commands from upon high and expecting us to follow… WE LEAD, THEY FOLLOW.
And the name change thing… that really didn't bother me, but the fact that OZ said they knew about it for months and didn't tell us, and that we artists were not allowed into the discussion from the beginning… that just highlights WOWIO and their habits.
Again, without artists, DD is an empty, barren ad farm… and if other artists don't speak up now… I don't know what else to say… NONE of the new changes should happen… artists should make it COMPLETELY clear that you won't stand for it… there are plenty of other webcomic sites, some with no ads at all, complete html editing and all the ad and link banners you care to use. You should stand up and make that clear… DD depends on US… and WE dictate what changes are made. Otherwise, shut her down… because it's going to fail anyway with no good artists remaining… do up the site the way WE want, or shut her down.
If you don't stand up to them now, you'll bend over for them forever… you decide. I've tried my best to help.
Actually what caused comics to move hosts or make mirrors on places like Comic Fury was the big crash and then the ongoing issues with fixes about 3 weeks ago Tim. Please don't confuse the arguments. They aren't entirely related.
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As for hissyfits and leaving-
I'll tell you guys something: Back when Platinum was making changes years ago and put those ugly mandatory ads underneath everyone's comics in that grey bar I really saw red. I was an admin at the time, but I still said that I'd quite DD if things didn't improve and I encouraged people to put stuff on their templates that said not to click the ad under their comics.
I moved most of my main efforts to my own self hosted site and saw DD as just another mirror for me at that stage.
I was very seriously thinking of quitting as an admin altogether.
DJ Coffman openly criticised my anti-Platinum stance in the main forums of DD because of that.
I got reprimanded privately by some high up people at Platinum, with lot's of people talking to me privately trying to mollify me…
So eventually they DID mollify me and I realised that for all my antipathy to the changes, if I left then there would be one less person to keep things on track for the DD community and help to stop further changes that everyone hated. In the end I loved DD and the community primarily and those issues were secondary.
Anyway, All websites have a constant turnover of users for all sorts of reasons, so leaving somewhere for most people isn't a big a deal as you may think at the time.
Actually what caused comics to move hosts or make mirrors on places like Comic Fury was the big crash and then the ongoing issues with fixes about 3 weeks ago Tim. Please don't confuse the arguments. They aren't entirely related.
Oh boy…
Okay, first off, I remember back when Platinum still owned this site, there were always a number of people complaining about their actions and their policies and how they were handling DD. The point is that whenever changes of any kind are made, whether from an original company or under new ownership, those changes are always going to piss some people off. I'm sure that Wowio could have launched a completely different beta version of the site, and the forums would still be flooded by people with problems of a completely different nature. Whenever changes of any kind are implemented on a mass scale like this on any site, you're always going to scare away a sizeable number of viewers in the process, regardless of how it's handled. The fact is, no matter what you do with a website, you'll never be able to satisfy everybody.
That being said, I do have to agree with most of the users in that Wowio could have seriously handled this a lot better than it did. Things like removing raw html are a serious deal-breaker with a lot of web-comic artists, and while I can understand why Wowio would want to do this from both a security-risk and business standpoint, it severely stunts creative freedom and in the long-run could damage them as a company, both in reputation and financially, and I seriously think they should reconsider their decisions on a lot of the new elements they want to implement in the site redisign. At the very least, I think they should compromise and make something akin to a drag-and-drop page creator (which I think is what skool is suggesting) while still allowing link-exchanges and user-created ads, even if only in a limited capacity.
And while I understand that some of these issues are non-negotiable (name change nonwithstanding, and I have to agree it was rather underhanded how Wowio handled that), it's also to my understanding that the mods and admins have argued and negotiated extensively with Wowio over many of these things, and I for one am glad that we have people like that who, even if the company won't listen to them in the end, are at least willing to try and raise as much hell as possible to voice the users' interests over matters like these. And for that, I am greatful.
So in the end, yes, if you want to blame Wowio for not paying as much attention to their userbase as they should, feel free to so; you deserve to speak your piece. But please, let's not start laying blame on people for things beyond their control and avoid turning this into an online shouting match.
it's also to my understanding that the mods and admins have argued and negotiated extensively with Wowio over many of these things, and I for one am glad that we have people like that who, even if the company won't listen to them in the end, are at least willing to try and raise as much hell as possible to voice the users' interests over matters like these. And for that, I am greatful.Thankyou for your support Dave.
i love the new comic preview system, including the filter, and also the featured comic preview,. only thing i would suggest here is to show whole titles if it is possible, and it would be nice to see when the comic was updated last time in main information, it's quite important for me. but in overall, it still progress :)
(and in my opinion DrunkDuck sounds much better, but i don't mind if you change it, the site itself is more important than the tittle)
-It's not just one programmer sitting in his office who we're dealing with on this. It's a great big design and programming team with a big business and management structure behind that. Big decision need to be made and approved by multiple layers.
-It's not just one programmer sitting in his office who we're dealing with on this. It's a great big design and programming team with a big business and management structure behind that. Big decision need to be made and approved by multiple layers.
Of course- But as I say there's a big team and a lot of layers, and It takes a lot to convince people to see things a certain way.-It's not just one programmer sitting in his office who we're dealing with on this. It's a great big design and programming team with a big business and management structure behind that. Big decision need to be made and approved by multiple layers.All that and NO-ONE said wait a minute this is going to piss people off big time?
That's a silly response. I KNOW FOR A FACT they're leaving because they've all joined and are now posting their comics on the same webcomics site I just joined. THIS IS MY EXPERIENCE, I CAN BACK IT UP WITH PROOF. Go visit the other sites instead of sitting here defending WOWIO, you'll see dozens of the top 100 comics on DD (including a couple of recent Feature comics) now on a couple of other webcomics sites, and they've all joined in the last week. PROOF, not worthless statements.
-Skool and I and our stance on Wowio-
We aren't anti-wowio, just pro DD. In some respects we're walking a line here, but it's our job to make sure both sides can resolve things: Put the Wowio case to DD and put the DD case to Wowio.
I'll just say that if people ARE setting up on other sites because they don't like where Wowio is going with DD, I strongly invite them to tell that to Oz or myself, since we can use that as evidence.The recent big crash reminded me I should work on my getting my own site functional before I get back in action. I already planned to do it. I figured DD would be equal or possibly that my own site would be the mirror.
Just one annoying little bug with the new site (I don't know if this has been noted)… on a comic page, if for example you're on page "1" you have to press "previous" to get to page 2 :S (unless I'm missing something, in which case, you haven't seeeeen or heeearrrd meeeee wooooooo thisss poossst doessssn't exxxxxiisssstttt!)
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