Blow it out your ass ozone, you pretentious twat.
Ps. REAL classy trying to compare this to Japan. Hope you feel real cozy about comparing the deaths of 11,000+ people to some comic company's inability to keep a website up.
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Comic Talk and General Discussion *
Nothing to see here, move along.
I think some of you are getting way to upset about this issue and need to calm down before posting more.
This is not a professional site. I could understand being upset at the situation (a bit) if everyone here had been paying Drunk Duck to host your comics. But that's not the issue.
I understand people have lots of work to do now, but crashes happen at every website from time to time. And with as much remodeling and updating as has been going on here it's quite frankly unreasonable to think it won't be a little slow or crash at times.
Honestly, I think for a lot of you this was the biggest drama of your week and therefore you're big chance to complain, but even if the site had completely imploded and your work was never to be heard from again… you still wouldn't have much cause to complain. This is a FREE SITE. Nothing was owed to you just because you decided to post your comic here.
I would like to say thank you to everyone who was trying so hard to fix everything. Having my comments back has seriously made my day. I didn't realize how much I love them. I'm going to be appreciating them so much more now!
Lefarce and Larry, You can leave if you like.
I don't care about your constant complaining one little bit.
You are wrong yet again and can't take it. You are childish and I am through humouring you both.
I am seriously convinced you read none of my posts. You see my googly-eyed Vegeta and go "THAT LEFARCE MUST BE UP TO HIS OLD TRICKS" and then you stop on your hat and write up some condescending crap about how much of a child I am for disagreeing with things (specifically you).
I myself were not particularly happy about this crap happening and I sure as heck aren't happy that allot of people have to reupload tons of content.
But I am happy that allot of previously assumed, permanently lost content, like the forum posts and page comments are back. At least the damage was contained with objects that could be reuploaded.
I'm also saddened about this crap happening, cause it will and has damaged the reputation of this site even more so. It's unavoidable now that people are going to leave after something like this and they will not recommend this site to others. This is something that's not going to be easy to shake off, even if the site redesign turns out to be an astounding success.
If I have to push any blame to wowio then that their mistake was opening up the site again, while things were as bad as it was. They should have kept the site closed for a bit longer, probably repost the "failduck" picture from last time and worked on double checking what was recoverable and what wasn't.
This would have prevented cases like the one vidihawk went through and it would have introduced us to a house with a burn room, instead of a roaring inferno which allot of us are still recovering from.
I can only hope this will be taken as a learning experience, which vowio has promised to learn from. They've stated that they're switching a server provider, who they're putting 100% the blame to. Take that with a grain of salt if you want but regardless of who was at fault, Lawrence Leach has been doing a great job at restoring what he could restore and he's still working on restoring the few comics that were downloaded into the beta site.
I'm not a vowio employee. I'm not expecting a job invite from them nor am I planing on seeking them out. I'm just glad that they were able to save what they could save and am still patiently waiting to see what will happen when the redesign is finally ready. But that doesn't mean I have endless amount of patience. I fully understand the decision of anyone who wishes to leave after this. This was a breaking point moment and one that was close to breaking me.
But I'm still willing to give them a chance with the redesign. Drunk Duck, with all of its problems is still operating on the original codes that it was first designed on. The redesign is the first time it's being build up from scratch. I want to see what happens when it's ready. I invite everyone to stick around and see what happens when it is.
…no pressure Vowio.
Edit:
I understand that people are still upset but some of you have reached a point where you're lashing out at each other. The best think you can do right now is to take a breather.
I myself went to the gym. Helped blow out tons of the steam that I had build up over this.
Blow it out your ass ozone, you pretentious twat.
Happy to see YOU go Larry.
You prudish, repressed, passive aggressive, mean, nasty, angry little man.
This current trouble has hit all DD very hard. ALL of DD!
Wowio has been working extremely hard to get things back to how they were , it was entirely OUT OF THEIR control.
This hit me and Skoolmunkee even harder because of all the work we do to keep things running and under control and all we had to do to alert people and get things back up behind the scenes etc.
The VERY LAST thing any one of us needs is a complaining, whining, annoying, useless pick harping on at us about what a terrible site this is, making it worse for us all.
Thanks Larry for trying to make things worse. It's the only thing you're any good at.
———-
Lefarce, if you are unfairly caught in the blast, I'm sorry.
Blow it out your ass, Larry. I have been sitting here for hours holding my tongue and watching you make an ass out of yourself. I decided not to saying anything because I wasn't on at all during the down time and I was quite relieved that I didn't have to reupload 200 pages. The images are a cake walk comparitively. But then you come in with a comic that has had barely 10 updates since January and you blow things way out proportion.
And you don't seem to understand the use of metaphors either. If you prefer one a little less recent how about just blaming natural disasters on anyone in general?
And I would like to apologize to binaryfaye for blowing up like this especially after you call for people to calm down.
Blow it out your ass, Larry. I have been sitting here for hours holding my tongue and watching you make an ass out of yourself. I decided not to saying anything because I wasn't on at all during the down time and I was quite relieved that I didn't have to reupload 200 pages. The images are a cake walk comparitively. But then you come in with a comic that has had barely 10 updates since January and you blow things way out proportion.Here here!
And you don't seem to understand the use of metaphors either. If you prefer one a little less recent how about just blaming natural disasters on anyone in general?
And I would like to apologize to binaryfaye for blowing up like this especially after you call for people to calm down.
Lefarce, even you have to admit that you've set a precedent that makes it hard for anyone to take you seriously. I don't think Ozone's in the wrong for wanting a little cooperation. If not for the fact that it's deserved, then at least for the fact that all of the complaining is making you look bad… and that other guy I already can't remember the name of. Lenny?
And what is the complaining going to change? It won't get two-and-a-half months of images back. It won't reverse time. It won't make the new storage host any more reliable than the old one was. Are you waiting for an apology?
We should be singing praises to Lawrence for fixing so much of a problem that wasn't his fault. It's true, when the site is free you are entitled to nothing. But here you got one man working overtime to save as much of the site as he could. He did a good job.
Ladies, ladies, you're all beautiful. :B
Seriously though, this is some of the most depressing and off-putting mod and admin behavior I have ever seen in a website. And that's saying something. Stop acting like children and start acting like the mature, guiding figures that you are supposed to be on this website. Just because users are disagreeing with you and upsetting you is no excuse for unmannerly behavior. Goodness.
Honestly this crash has done more than caused a mass upset with very vocal users.
Not only has it shaken the faith of the userbase and possibly spurred a migration to rival comic hosting sites, it has shown that there are some issues with hosting and preparation. Even if Drunk Duck is not a professional website, it shouldn't be making such an elementary error as using the server it is hosted on as where it keeps its backups (if it has any, which in all honesty I really hope they do keep more than just the occasional offsite backups.) I just hope that this has helped egg those in charge of our site on to do their jobs in a more professional manner - mods, admins, and developers alike.
Edit (I wasn't planning on adding this, but I don't want to come off as just BLARGH BLARGH BLARGH BLARGH, you know? :C ) :
Come on guys, in a time like this cooperation and being open to your userbase is kind of needed. Also, Ozone, let's not bring Japan into this. My friend Kaoru is still missing over there. That's not nice.
I am sorry if my dumb little story came off excessive. I wasn't trying to blame DrunkDuck for this catastrophe. It sounds like little could have been done from your side, aside from choosing a different server host (and I would hope that alternative is being actively considered).
I just had these problems with what happened and, for the sake of my comic (tiny and ineffectual as it is), I will be moving on. I have gotten a lot out of this community, and I don't leave with any sort of spite toward it or the site.
I just… am going to go. I am sorry if that's a problem, but that won't change my mind. I only even mentioned the problems I have in hopes that they may be someday corrected.
Seriously though, this is some of the most depressing and off-putting mod and admin behavior I have ever seen in a website.If I was behaving badly I would just delete threads. But I think people deserve their say even if it galls me.
-I did not bring Japan into this, that was Larry. I used a simile. If no one can use metaphor, analogy, or simile we may as well stop speaking.
_______________________
What personally galls me most is the unquestioning heaping criticism on Drunk Duck and Wowio when neither was responsible for this incident, as I and many others keep on trying to explain.
We and Wowio actually worked extremely hard to try and get things back again.
With the work and time I personally put into this site through all hours of the day and night, with all I have invested it here, trying to keep things going, trying to keep people happy, trying to keep all their work intact, promoting people…
And all they can do is ignore what we say and attack us.
______________________
I am incredibly sad for what happened to DD. Skool and I are comic artists here too and the problems of DD hit us 10X harder because we're not just responsible for our own comics, but for all the thousands of users here as well.
_____________________
Understand this:
You can NOT escape these sorts of problems. And the next place you go may not have people dedicated to the site and so desperately concerned with getting things back again.
Oh my gosh, I agreed with Larry and - foolishly - revealed too much. It's true, we were behind it all. I snuck into the DD House late at night to rearrange the pots and pans, just to confound you all, but then I ran into Larry. Oh my he's an evil which I cannot describe! He seduced me into destroying the DD server with him, and we erased ALL THE DATA!
[url=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oMtdXaqBx4#t=1m59s
]QUICK LARRY, LETS GET OUT OF HERE!
crocty, your avatar is pawsibly the most purrfect thing I have evfurr laid eyes on. :33 (Also sadly, DD keeps timing out and my Nepeta avatar won't load for me. ; n ; )
That aside
Ozone, I really hope that first reply was a joke. Because behaving badly and then deleting all evidence of ever having done so is the mot unprofessional thing an admin can do. Additionally, don't use Larry as a scapegoat in the mentioning of Japan and your likening its disaster to what happened to the site.
You were the first one to mention Japan - I read all the posts carefully before I decided to reply. Perhaps you should have done the same. "What people are tending to do now is akin to blaming the Japanese government for their Earthquake and Tsumani." Simile or not, it was uncalled for given the proximity of the disaster, the timeframe in which it had happened, the nature of this thread, and your blatant disregard for the users here who may have friends, family, or even loved ones lost, missing or possibly dead in Japan.
Moving right along, regardless of whether it was or wasn't Wowio or DrunkDuck's fault, there should have been proper precautions in place. If DrunkDuck/Wowio wants to provide a service, even for free, there should be precautions taken to prevent cases such as this. As I said previously, having the backups on the same place you host the website is an elementary mistake. With DD being an unprofessional site it's to be expected that such mistakes happen. It's just that given what has happened in the past, the users had higher hopes for the site. They were hoping to see the improvement you all had promised, so of course they are going to be upset, irrational, etc.
Ozone, not all of the users are ignoring what you say and attacking you. Some of us really do take the time to read and reread posts before we decide to open our yaps. Just because someone's opinion and thoughts on a matter differ from your own does not make what they say a personal affront. I wish you could realize this, since it would make user-admin relations a tad less heated. :C
Edit: …I hope I didn't come off as too harsh there in the Japan post. It's tough not knowing if someone you care about is still with you or not but at the same time completely infuriating to see people with no sensitivity towards others feelings. Argh! It is difficult to keep ones' temper in such a situation, and I apologize in advance for bruised egos.
Ozone, I really hope that first reply was a joke. Because behaving badly and then deleting all evidence of ever having done so is the mot unprofessional thing an admin can do.Which is why I said I don't do that.
Additionally, don't use Larry as a scapegoat in the mentioning of Japan and your likening its disaster to what happened to the site.He is the one who talked about it literally.
I was talking in simile
There is a huge difference
——————-
I am NOT responding with vehemence to user dissatisfaction.
I am only responding to unreasonable criticism by Larry and Lefarce.
I am personally affected by the issues as much as anyone else. I am a user here too. Please understand this.
Do not take my posts the wrong way.
I think you have
–Edit-
And now I know why. You are best friends with Larry and several other known troll users.
Very interesting.
Ozone, you didn't state in your post that the deleting threads thing was a joke. Furthermore, if you reread the replies, you might find that maybe he, too, felt that even as a simile, it was something that shouldn't have been said, as it was disrespectful and hurtful. I don't know how many times I'm going to have to reiterate that before you stop repeating that "I was talking in simile, therefore it makes it okay." excuse.
I understand that you are just as much subject to the site crash as the general userbase is; I never stated that I thought otherwise. However as a person in a seat of power (An admin, no less), you should at least try to maintain a professional demeanor even in the face of ruffians such as Larry. Even I have done that much in regards to my replies to you, and I am but a lowly user with barely two comic pages on Drunk Duck and a very, very short fuse.
I am not taking your posts the wrong way, you were simply posting in a manner that was unprofessional, rude, and is now slowly becoming increasingly incoherent.
Now as much as I would love to continue wasting my evening prattling, I simply can't as I have work tomorrow. I bid you a good evening, and I thank you for taking the time out of your increasingly busy schedule to listen to my banter.
Look, I think we can all agree on several things at this point.
What happened pissed a lot of us off, granted. And from what I've read it looks like most of us still are, including me. But complaining about what happened isn't going to undo anything or help anyone. At the same time, what happened shouldn't have happened in the first place. I don't know whether DD, Wowio, or whoever is to blame, and quite frankly I don't care; the point is that I think we should at least be thankful that the damage done was relatively limited and that we didn't lose everything. As aggravating as it is to have go back and re-post your stuff since January, they've managed to recover enough data to at least make it possible to do, even if it is time-consuming, which considering the circumstances is really saying something. Considering that this is a free site, the fact that ANYONE stepped in to even TRY to do something to fix it in the first place says a lot. At the same time, though, it does show that there're a lot of things we still have to improve on this site, but they can't all be fixed overnight.
For those of you who are taking this as the last straw and want to leave, that's perfectly fine, nobody's going to make you try to stay here, and personally I don't blame you for wanting to do so, but shit like this happens not just to web-comic sites but sites in general all the f*cking time. Granted, this has been happening rather often lately ever since the site transferred to Wowio, but from what I've seen, they've at least fixed most of these problems in a more-or-less timely manner as they've come up, which is more than I can say for a lot of other sites I've visited and hosted my stuff on.
Now from what I've read it seems at this point that we're now taking out our frustrations on each other.
Users: some of us do these comics for fun, some as hobbies, some as therapy (like me), some even as professionals, even for profit. I'm probably as upset about this as the next person and will likely be angry for awhile, and even more so if these sort of things keep happening. At the same time, though, the fact that the site is up and running in and least SOME capacity shows that there are people working to fix this and hopefully they'll improve the site to prevent this sort of thing in the future. But the fact of the matter is that shit happens, plain and simple.
Admins: I appreciate that you've put in a lot of time and effort and have gone out of your way to help, and I can honestly believe that having to deal with several thousand of us en masse when we're all complaining can be very stressful to an ungodly degree, and I thank you sincerely for staying with us regardless and not just collectively rage-quitting on a whim. For some of us, though, our comics are our livelihood or even a source of supplemental revenue that we host here because we can't afford to host it on a paysite, so naturally when something like this happens, we're going to complain about it regardless of the circumstances, and I'm truly glad that you endure whatever criticisms we throw at you and everyone else when we do, whether it's misplaced or not.
I think at this point that maybe the best thing to do is for all of us to just maybe log-out for a while and calm down and try to look at it from each other's perspectives. I love this site, and the last thing I want to see happen is for people to start posting things that could get them banned, cost them their jobs, or even get this site shut down.
How about it?
Ozone, you didn't state in your post that the deleting threads thing was a joke.Xepher, I was not joking. You have completely misread my post. Please go back and read it carefully!
-You accused me of "bad behaviour". I gave you an example of REAL bad behaviour by an admin.
-Edit-
I'm sorry, but this IS coloured by the fact that Larry is your friend.
Furthermore, if you reread the replies, you might find that maybe he, too, felt that even as a simile, it was something that shouldn't have been said, as it was disrespectful and hurtful.No, he did not. He deliberately misrepresented that to make an issue of it. He does things like that. He has a long history of it. He is an abusive, bullying, problem user who has a history of bullying other users and harassing them using all sorts of childish tactics.
As you well know, I'm sure.
I am sorry if my manner offends you Xepher, but I am an ordinary person first, and a normal DD user who's had his artwork on this site for years, and years. I feel very invested in the continuation of this website and extremely passionate about it.
I am not an admin of this site because I like power, I'm an admin of this site because I love it and I'm dedicated to it and helping maintain it for all the users here.
For people Like you personally: I am overjoyed that you have chosen to host your comic here. Whether it has 2 pages or 2000 it still means a lot to me that your account isn't damaged or harmed in any way and that you're able to keep posting comics here, and if you stop posting here I hope you continue to make your comic and have a lot of success wherever you post it! Don't ask Larry or Lefarce to feel that way.
Right now I have more work to do for it. There are more important things for me do do than respond to unreasonable personal attacks.
—-
-Edit-
OK, it seems this whole "Bad behaviour" stuff and all comments by Xepher are a sham.
She's actually best friends with Larry and several other known problem users and trolls.
Good one man. I actually believed you were offended. Turns out your were just defending your troll friends. Not smart.
-Edit again-
Ok Xepher, I will accept that the known trolls that make up your friends list are not actually good friends, and that you aren't a troll too, but just a normal user who was coming to the defence of someone you knew and that you had no idea that Larry was deliberately trying to stir things up.
Good morning everybody, what did I miss? … oh.
I guess I just have a few points (in addition to Dave7's very sensible post)-
- I completely understand the anger and frustration from you guys. I (and Wowio) know this will send some people away because they have lost faith or are looking at a lot of work. It is true that most of the site was saved, but that's not a lot of consolation to the people who are now facing lots of tedious editing, or are having problems with their comics altogether. Some people may even see that advice as condescending.
- Everyone has mine, Oz, and the people at Wowio's sincerest apologies, even though most of us had nothing to do with what happened whatsoever. We were all just as crushed and upset as you. Even if we weren't as personally affected by it, we definitely feel a HUGE responsibility to you guys and your preceptions of/relationship with the site.
- I agree that it should not have happened, but I don't know enough about the situation to start laying too much blame. In this we can only go off the information Wowio chooses to release, but it would be a mistake to go distrusting what they say because you are upset.
- I'm not sure that I agree with the "you can't complain about a free service" thing. While it's true everyone would be MUCH unhappier if they were paying for the service, that doesn't mean they shouldn't be unhappy because it's free. There's an expectation of reliability and user satisfaction, a standard of service, that people come to rely on when they use any site. Having that suddenly fail is very upsetting.
- We keep regular contact with Wowio and spoke with them yesterday when this was all happening, so I find the characterisation of them as incompetent chortling fatcats as particularly unfair. Wowio is made up of regular people who all care about doing their jobs right, care about the site and its users, and want DD to be a site they love. They're well aware of DD's history and how this looks for them.
- From what I know of the beta site under development, the plan for its construction and storage has always been different, and not as a reaction to what happened yesterday. I think I can also guess that once they've recovered as much as they can from this, all focus will be on the beta and making sure that is as finished as possible as quickly as possible. It's really unfortunate this happened at all, but moreso now than in 1 or 2 months when it wouldn't have mattered a fraction as much.
Everyone is entitled to their say and I don't think anyone expects everyone to be positive and forgiving of what happened. As long as people aren't making big upsets based on wrong assumptions, or making personal attacks, I don't intend to step in much. (Of course we are happy to answer questions and talk about whatever information we do have.)
I for one would like to thank the people who had to work hard to bring everything back up. While not everything was recovered, they still acted quickly and restored everything they could and are working hard to make sure it either never happens again or if it does the damage will be mitigated. I remember last time the Duck went down. Not sure if the site had backups back then, but since I didn't keep a backup of my own comics back then I lost them all. Keeping a site like this up probably isn't easy, and it hasn't gotten any easier through the years as DrunkDuck has grown. Anyways…
To the people who work to keep this free webcomic site up, my thanks to you for all the hard work. :)
Job well done to those who sucked it up and got the recovery done. Great effort all around in bringing order out of a big disaater. It's a computer they go tits up without anyone doing anything and shit gets lost.
For the some of the rest of us.
Shit happens. I wasn't looking forward to having to reload every page since January but it happens. I can wait for the creators of my favorites to reload their pages so I know what the comments mean about the most recent pages.
Some people around here never heard of FIDO. And I hope you're never in a situation when something serious happens because you'll learn that; to suck it up, not get angry and hurl insults, gets shit fixed. Otherwise you'll show yourself up for part of the problem not the solution.
Shit happens and you just have to deal with it and move on. Fuck It Drive On. FIDO.
Get me another cup of coffee this is going to be a long day.
The VERY LAST thing any one of us needs is a complaining, whining, annoying, useless pick harping on at us about what a terrible site this is, making it worse for us all.
And I thank you two because, being the main mods and the liaisons, you guys are probably two of the first people that get the heat ^^;
These sort of things have happened many times here, and I just hope that it doesn't happen again or anytime soon. I'm just happy to have my comments and posts back, because those are important to me. Like others said, I hope this doesn't turn others off the site; I for one will stay because I like the environment here and I'm pretty patient through these things :D. But you know, like I said on the thread that's now gone, I wouldn't mind paying a monthly subscription fee if it means having a more efficient site.
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