I miss that time when Jude Law was in every single film :(
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I started watching the American version of The Office.
It's not bad. No where near as savage and cutting at the original, but it has its own charm. The first series of it seemed to be trying to closely mirror the original, with the boss being closer to David Brent in his sleazy, unatractive glory…
But in the second season they toned it down and rounded off the edges. The boss gets better hair and nices clothes that actually fit, rather than the slightly oversized look in the first season. It works better that way for an American context. I don't think American comedy works as well with an edge.
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Comic Talk and General Discussion *
What are you watching right now?
I've heard a lot of good things about the Queen's Gambit!
I actually have only watched the American version of The Office. I did see one or two episodes from the British version, and it was definitely a bit more wry than slapstick. American Michael Scott gets pretty ridiculous in some episodes though, and I don't think Andy joins the cast until later seasons…the interplay between him and Dwight is hilarious.
Amazon Prime offered us The Gentlemen which I hadn't even heard of before, with Matthew McConaughey, Charlie Hunnam, Michelle Dockery and Colin Farrell. Turned out to be a Guy Ritchie movie, so cool gangsters, lots of fun dialogue, plenty of action, unexpected twists and blood spatter. ★★★★★
dpat57 wrote:I don't really enjoy Guy Ritchie films that much. Lock Stock was good because it was about amateurs taking on an unfamiliar world of crime in Britain, and succeeding…
Amazon Prime offered us The Gentlemen which I hadn't even heard of before, with Matthew McConaughey, Charlie Hunnam, Michelle Dockery and Colin Farrell. Turned out to be a Guy Ritchie movie, so cool gangsters, lots of fun dialogue, plenty of action, unexpected twists and blood spatter. ★★★★★
But mostly he has a world of hyper-masculinity where humanity and life don't mean anything and violence and torture are like air… I find that unpleasant.
It's a shame because he usually has good stories, great actors, and gets great performances out of them.
I have just awarded the movie KILL BILL as the WORST MOVIE EVER! I gave it the kybosh with about 15 minutes left as I couldn't take anymore. Many scenes go on and on and just when you think it can't go any further, it does. Quentin Tarantino, Uma Thurman, what drugs were they on? My bad movie rating is 0 but this one gets a minus 5!
moizmad wrote:
I have just awarded the movie KILL BILL as the WORST MOVIE EVER! I gave it the kybosh with about 15 minutes left as I couldn't take anymore. Many scenes go on and on and just when you think it can't go any further, it does. Quentin Tarantino, Uma Thurman, what drugs were they on? My bad movie rating is 0 but this one gets a minus 5!
Oh, that's too bad! Kill Bill is one of my favorite movies. :(
I started watching The Barrier, a Spanish Netflix show. I'm about halfway through and it's pretty good so far.
moizmad wrote:
I have just awarded the movie KILL BILL as the WORST MOVIE EVER! I gave it the kybosh with about 15 minutes left as I couldn't take anymore. Many scenes go on and on and just when you think it can't go any further, it does. Quentin Tarantino, Uma Thurman, what drugs were they on? My bad movie rating is 0 but this one gets a minus 5!
I rarely have the same opinion as you on films and TV shows but I have to agree here. It's painful to watch. Hands down QTs worst movie, well I haven't seen part two so that could be worse.
The whole secret to watching Kill Bill is to fast forward through any dialogue and just watch the fights. Some of the best choreographed martial arts fight scenes ever. If you didn't see a lot of the films they reference it can be a pretty empty viewing experience though.
Kill Bill 2 is better because David Carradine has a much bigger part. That's when it really becomes a great tribute to those old Kung fu films.
Most Tarantino films can easily be trimmed by thirty to forty-five minutes without losing anything.
Me? Been watching Second City Television episodes from the 1980s. Not as funny as I remember but very creative. I'd forgotten just how much of Dave Thomas' work had been cribbed by Mike Myers.
bravo, "choreographed" nails it, old kung fu/karate movies are beyond stupid, anyone who watches UFC knows nobody fights like that, and if you were in a real street fight, you'd be using eye-gouging and flesh tearing, at least I sure would. Nothing funnier than SCTV's Monster Chiller Horror Theatre with host Count Floyd and John Candy's really scary Dr. Tongue and his unbelievable 3D effects! Gives you the willies just thinking about it.
moizmad wrote:All movies and TV shows with fighting are like that now, from John Whick to James Bond to Buffy the Vampire Slayer, The Witcher and so on.
bravo, "choreographed" nails it, old kung fu/karate movies are beyond stupid, anyone who watches UFC knows nobody fights like that, and if you were in a real street fight, you'd be using eye-gouging and flesh tearing, at least I sure would.
It's ALLLLLL choreographed in a stylised, gratingly fake way
THIS is the PERFECT, very best and ultimate exemplar of ALL of those sorts of fights in the most honest way possible. No pretence that it's not "fake", just pure style :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2C9CoAbwxy0
("Girl Hunt Ballet" — Fred Astaire and Cyd Charisse, 1953)
I've never seen Kill Bill, mainly because I don't like too much brutal violence and blood… But Stylisation helps ignore that aspect so I might give it a go.
More Girl Hunt Ballet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8QmkDzD8Sk
Feeling cruddy last week, I needed "comfort TV," so I rewatched the 1955 ROBIN HOOD series. One of my favorites. It has the atmosphere of a superhero series. It's from the same era with some of the same actors as the SHERLOCK HOLMES series I also rewatch on occasion.
Having finished the series (again), I started looking through the unwatched things on my Netflix list and found that there are now dubbed versions of the subtitled series I had been putting off.
So, now I'm watching PARANORMAL, which is an Egyptian 'horror' series. Unlike American horror that I tried to watch, it isn't unbearably slow, and unlike the Korean horror I attempted, it isn't stupidly gory. It has a good pace, semi-free-standing episodes (but definitely folded into a serial), and I can see what is going on. Not a lot of "jump scares," just supernatural things and a fair bit of mystery. I'm only two episodes in. The second episode was basically like the 1990s The Mummy but with Egyptians and less ridiculous (or more modern) CG. (It even had scarab beetles, but they were beetle-sized and didn't eat people. Just "omens.")
@ozoneocean: thanks for the link to girl hunt ballet! In my opinion, it's not a real fight scene unless at least one person is wearing pointe shoes!
Eastern Promises has a reasonably realistic fight scene in it. Leave it to David Cronenberg to choreograph it like it is!
Ozoneocean wrote:moizmad wrote:All movies and TV shows with fighting are like that now, from John Whick to James Bond to Buffy the Vampire Slayer, The Witcher and so on.
bravo, "choreographed" nails it, old kung fu/karate movies are beyond stupid, anyone who watches UFC knows nobody fights like that, and if you were in a real street fight, you'd be using eye-gouging and flesh tearing, at least I sure would.
It's ALLLLLL choreographed in a stylised, gratingly fake way
THIS is the PERFECT, very best and ultimate exemplar of ALL of those sorts of fights in the most honest way possible. No pretence that it's not "fake", just pure style :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2C9CoAbwxy0
("Girl Hunt Ballet" — Fred Astaire and Cyd Charisse, 1953)
I've never seen Kill Bill, mainly because I don't like too much brutal violence and blood… But Stylisation helps ignore that aspect so I might give it a go.
More Girl Hunt Ballet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T8QmkDzD8Sk
I mostly agree, although there are some notable exceptions. Not in blockbuster movies though. In amongst my various martial arts experience I've trained with a few stunt performers and trained in screen fighting. Obviously it has to be well choreographed, but it doesn't have to be so obvious.
I've been rewatching Dexter, i've gotten on to the not so good later seasons but I'll keep going as it's coming back next year to give it a better ending.
Should be pointed out that fights have always been choreographed for as long as there's been theater.
Slapstick too is usually carefully planned and rehearsed, though there have been plenty of goofs and improvisations caught on camera.
As shown in the Fred Astaire/Cydia Charisse clip: dancers and acrobats can stage very good fights even better than actual martial artists. Saw a making of video for the Cutey Honey live action where they went over how they trained the actresses to fight. All had taken dancing and acrobatic training first to do the moves and falls and then the martial arts for the strikes and moves. It's acting.
You really think bar fights happen like they do in Westerns? John Wayne versus Randolph Scott or Victor McLaughlin? Choreographed in detail with stunt performers and a little mischief by John Ford.
bravo1102 wrote:There's a misunderstanding here Bravo
Should be pointed out that fights have always been choreographed for as long as there's been theater.
Of course theatrical fights are choreographed, they HAVE to be.
The problem is that they looks silly when they're too sylised so that your suspension of disbelif is broken and you can SEE that they're choreographed.
Obviously stylised fights can be ok in Martial arts films where the fighting is mainly a symbolic representation of a fight, but in modern American films it's a little stupid because it contrasts too starkly with the naturalistic acting style which is what they do for the rest of the film (because that's popular at the moment).
A lot of old Westerns and gangster films had fights that were a little too stylised but then so was the acting so the contrast wasn't as grating.
usedbooks wrote:
So, now I'm watching PARANORMAL, which is an Egyptian 'horror' series. Unlike American horror that I tried to watch, it isn't unbearably slow, and unlike the Korean horror I attempted, it isn't stupidly gory. It has a good pace, semi-free-standing episodes (but definitely folded into a serial), and I can see what is going on. Not a lot of "jump scares," just supernatural things and a fair bit of mystery. I'm only two episodes in. The second episode was basically like the 1990s The Mummy but with Egyptians and less ridiculous (or more modern) CG. (It even had scarab beetles, but they were beetle-sized and didn't eat people. Just "omens.")
Another vote for Paranormal, the Egyptian series. The cinematography was brilliant, especially with the creepiness vibe. Reminded me a bit of The Ring (the appearance and story arc of the main ghost character was very similar to Samara/Sadako).
Pretty much everything I watch on Netflix is non-US lately…I like that Netflix is bringing to light shows from other countries. I recently watched a Polish series called The Hater which was pretty good, but the character is an absolute sociopath.
Oz. Might want to watch Blood on the Sun (1945) Jimmy Carney trained in martial arts for a fight in the movie, one of the first in any American film. The westerners playing Asians are almost ridiculous with Bruce Armstrong (King Kong 1933) playing Tojo.
There's choreographed, and there's "what the hell are they doing?" So you're right there. Even the fights in something as recent as ST:Discovery weren't very convincing other than Lucy Liu.
But like so many things in film it's down to the director. The fight coordinator could come up with a hyper realistic sequence and the director nixes it because it looks awful on camera.
L.C.Stein wrote:Same, and I'll put out a general recommendation to check out European animation. Only one really disappointed me, Jack and the Clock Heart (visually stunning but garbage story). The best thing about watching non-American productions, especially one-offs, is that they don't follow Hollywood formulas or designs. American animation tends to be especially formulaic, tropey, and predictable. I enjoy watching a production where I actually can't predict the entire ending. I love the variety Netflix offers. Always love to see more.
Pretty much everything I watch on Netflix is non-US lately…I like that Netflix is bringing to light shows from other countries. I recently watched a Polish series called The Hater which was pretty good, but the character is an absolute sociopath.
I watched 10 minutes of the Haunting of Bly Manor. The writing is painfully forced and unnatural, and the acting is horrible. Why do people give this stuff such glowing reviews and recommendations??
I swear I feel like I'm being punked. I see a ton of people recommend a series only to discover it is Peter-Jackson's-The-Hobbit level terrible. And at least The Hobbit cast could ACT.
(I wanted to give it a chance. I figured it might not be my "thing" based on the genre and style. But I didn't expect it to be objectively bad. If it was slow or boring, it'd be forgivable. But when it feels like it was written and performed by six graders in a mandatory drama class, I gotta give it a hard pass.)
bravo1102 wrote:But like so many things in film it's down to the director. The fight coordinator could come up with a hyper realistic sequence and the director nixes it because it looks awful on camera.Ya, based on this conversation here we chatted about fight scenes in the latest Quackcast…
Real fights are awful to watch. They're funny, stupid looking, quick and lame, even the most deadly. Even gunfights in a military context/
UFC and boxing isn't "real" organic fighting, those people are paid entertainers and sportspeople. The fights aren't faked or anything but they're not real people in a fight.
(their moves are crowd-pleasing, there are things they aren't allowed to do, the fights are artificially extended and slowed by rules and the format etc)
So yeah, any kind of "real" fight looks terrible on screen. It's the job of the crew to choreograph the fake fighting so that it looks cool but not overly fake.
usedbooks wrote:Hype will do that :(
I swear I feel like I'm being punked.
It's like with the Witcher: to many it seemed it was the best show EVER. but really the only great thing about it was Henry Cavell. Sets were bad, plotting was bad, costumes were lame, plot holes galore, dodgy times-kips with parallel stories, and so on. It was FUN but not great. Henry Cavell definitely saved it though.
usedbooks wrote:
I watched 10 minutes of the Haunting of Bly Manor. The writing is painfully forced and unnatural, and the acting is horrible. Why do people give this stuff such glowing reviews and recommendations??
I swear I feel like I'm being punked. I see a ton of people recommend a series only to discover it is Peter-Jackson's-The-Hobbit level terrible. And at least The Hobbit cast could ACT.
(I wanted to give it a chance. I figured it might not be my "thing" based on the genre and style. But I didn't expect it to be objectively bad. If it was slow or boring, it'd be forgivable. But when it feels like it was written and performed by six graders in a mandatory drama class, I gotta give it a hard pass.)
I watched it and really enjoyed it. Some dodgy accents aside I didn't have an issue with either the acting or the writing. Maybe it's because I'm used to worse acting on horrors. Still different strokes for different folks.
I started watching star trek the lower decks, it's not as bad as I feared. In fact in many ways it's the trek show I've been wanting bro see, but the comedy is a little ott for me but not unbearable.
I didn't watch horror movies growing up. It was never my thing. I watched spooky kids' anthology series. As an adult, I love horror anthologies and ghost stories.
So when someone recommends a horror movie/series, I check it out. But I have yet to find (a popular) one I can actually sit through. (The one exception was Get Out, which I did enjoy, as it felt like The Outer Limits.) And it has nothing to do with it being "too scary" or "gross." They just don't manage to suspend disbelief because the characters do not react to the world like real people do, and the acting is so unnatural. Is this just something horror fans tolerate and have become oblivious to?
Horror and sci-fi anthologies have brilliant acting, as a whole. The writing is hit-or-miss. 80% of Black Mirror is the same stupid plot recycled in different forms, but the actors are fantastic, so I can at least sit through them. (I guess knowing it's just an episode makes it easier to invest too.)
I enjoyed the series Evil. Paranormal was enjoyable, too, albeit predictable. And The Girl With All the Gifts was fantastic – despite being a zombie movie and chock full of tropes.
I do try to be "hype" immune. Things tend to get accolades for a reason, so I expect at least something solid. I am starting to get the feeling that people who grew up with horror movies have a much higher tolerance for bad acting, though. (Tbh, the acting and writing in horror movie is the exact same level as in Hallmark Christmas movies. I guess it's a quantity over quality issue. People who enjoy them are used to them, so it's just their comfort zone.)
It's funny that you mention Get out, that was a hyped up movie that I found quite average. If you want a horror series that is worth watching, Lovecraft country, although it definitely revels on the gore at times. I haven't seen Evil or Paranormal, but have heard good things.
Genejoke wrote:
It's funny that you mention Get out, that was a hyped up movie that I found quite average. If you want a horror series that is worth watching, Lovecraft country, although it definitely revels on the gore at times. I haven't seen Evil or Paranormal, but have heard good things.
"Average" is pretty much the top of horror movie spectrum for me. XD There are very few movies I consider excellent, and none of them are horror. None of them are action movies either. I do enjoy the experiences, but they are definitely "in-the-moment" genres, not masterpieces by any stretch. They're what I call "amusement park ride" movies.) Gore usually takes me out of a film/show (my suspension of disbelief crashes down; maybe because of all the fake-ass haunted houses I've been to, lol), but I'll check it out.
Evil is interesting because you never know if it's supernatural or not. Paranormal really isn't that scary. I'm not sure if it's horror, feels a bit like adventure to me (kinda like the 90s The Mummy, that in-between horror-adventure genre). I also like that both are more episodic than serial (but do have a continuity). That's part of what makes them watchable for me. I like to have satisfying pay-off at intervals not wait an entire series for a climax/conclusion. (They also have very good acting, which is the most important thing for me.)
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