Thread "Discussion about Mafia" in forum "MAFIA... and other forum games"

Posted at 2:08PM, Aug. 1, 2010

From the Mafia XXXII thread:

I know some other had some different mafia ideas that we have though might not fit with the mafia brand. I believe now would be a good time to host something a bit different. It just won't officially be Mafia XXXIII.

A proposal:

On an old forum I used to be a part of, we'd have 'survival' style games.
A special forum would be made for it and every few days, a new challenge was posted, and the winner would gain immunity.

The challenges would be stuff like, who gets the highest score in an online tetris game, or who can make the best looking graphic, or even aim/msn "quiz" shows where a mod asked questions and the first player that replied with the right answer got the point.

Anyway, after the challenges were over, everyone would pq their nominations to a mod to kick out one person for that day.

Underneath all this, players were allowed to make secret alliances to kick out certain people, or make pacts to be the last 2 in the game, and compete against each other in that last round. The catch is, all these pq's and aim conversations had to be recorded. At the end of the game, everyone posted all their old conversations in their own personal threads so everyone could see the deals that were made behind their backs.

One game I played in had one person make a pact with literally everyone in the game, and backstabbed every single one of them. When played ambitiously, the game gets really fun and competitive.

——

I'm mentioning this since it's similar to the mafia games, and as an alternative to the current way things are done. A lot of people seem to have lost interest in the game and that's a bit sad.

Posted at 2:08PM, Aug. 1, 2010

That would be a good idea to try out during the break. It is not exactly like mafia so it may work. Give people who just want too be competitive something fun to work at. There might be some issues when it comes to the actual voting phase, as you said, it is part of the game. If you want some separate space for it, we can use a comic's forum.

Posted at 4:08PM, Aug. 1, 2010

That would be a good idea to try out during the break. It is not exactly like mafia so it may work. Give people who just want too be competitive something fun to work at. There might be some issues when it comes to the actual voting phase, as you said, it is part of the game. If you want some separate space for it, we can use a comic's forum.

It'd be easy to make a new comic just for the game, and use the forum that comes with it.

But it's just an idea if people are tired of mafia.

Posted at 4:08PM, Aug. 1, 2010

It's going to be annoying to access the forum, since you'd have to first look up the comic and the access the forum from there (unless you create some sort of shortcut, like creating a stickied thread on forum games with a link location to the forum). Increased difficulty will mean less people that are willing to go there to play. Why can't a single survivor-esk game be contained in a single game thread?

Posted at 6:08PM, Aug. 1, 2010

Hm, a main problem that seems to have gone unadressed for ages is the matter that people simply lose interest in a game when they're plain townies.
I don't really remember how well the game went where everyone had roles, but that's one possible solution, though the mafia would have to be powered up too.

Or maybe some new rule could be introduced that gets everyone, even lame townies involved.

I don't know, but it is definitely a problem that needs addressing somehow.

Posted at 6:08PM, Aug. 1, 2010

My problem is that if we stop mafia it may never come back.

But adding a role that makes someone not a townie-like gives them something fun to do at the very least sounds like a good idea.

Posted at 8:08PM, Aug. 1, 2010

Hm, a main problem that seems to have gone unadressed for ages is the matter that people simply lose interest in a game when they're plain townies.

This is a really big problem with the current mafia game.

In the games in the past where I had an actual role, I was more excited about the game to see the results of my actions. It was also more interesting since I was constantly on the lookout for clues that might out my identity.

As a townie however, there's little to no incentive for playing the game. Sure you can try to solve clues, but ultimately, you're just waiting to be killed on suspicion of being mafia. The major attitude will be, why even bother?

Posted at 10:08PM, Aug. 1, 2010

So what you guys are saying that you want another run of "madness continues"?

Posted at 6:08AM, Aug. 2, 2010

The other side of the coin is the mafia usually hide behind the townies. It is easier for them, especially the godfather to do so, because the detective is blind to him. One "with it" mayor can find the all the mafia quickly during a role collection or at least have a narrow list of suspects.

Posted at 6:08AM, Aug. 2, 2010

That's why I downgraded the detective so that he could no longer distinguish between the roles. He can still realize if you're a criminal or not but the godfather now passes completely under his radar. It was done to stop the pro-town exploit of denying townies from running which made the game even more boring for them and to make it easier for the mafia to infiltrate the town.

Posted at 7:08AM, Aug. 2, 2010

The other side of the coin is the mafia usually hide behind the townies. It is easier for them, especially the godfather to do so, because the detective is blind to him. One "with it" mayor can find the all the mafia quickly during a role collection or at least have a narrow list of suspects.

Actually this is a good point, the mafia would have a harder time hiding.
That's what was wrong with the game where everyone got a role…

Bugger.

Posted at 8:08AM, Aug. 2, 2010

Another thing I want to try at least once. Is to keep the voting secret. We would still display the counts but not who voted. The detective's power instead of seeing how many mafia voted would be to see the list of voters for a specific person. At the end of the game the votes would be displayed.

PP said that this would give the mafia a chance to hide and rally up. But, not all mafia are organized.

But not all detectives take advantage of their role either.

-sigh-

Posted at 8:08AM, Aug. 2, 2010

The biggest problem with my "all role" game was the Celebrity politician. It was just too good of an unifying force for the town and everyone could trust that player enough to send him their roles.

I designed that game so that a certain group of players could go either way and choose how they wanted to end it. In the end they made the biggest impact.

Having townies didn't used to be a problem and we've had over 30 games now. I've been a townie more often then I've had a role and I haven't minded that much. Frankfully, I find the current defeatist attitude to be silly cause even if the town doesn't want to admit it, they can still win the current game (I should know, since I'm the one behind the scenes).

Posted at 8:08AM, Aug. 2, 2010

As my brother says: You get what you get and you don't throw a fit. (Damn my parents for giving him rhyming mantras)

Posted at 6:08AM, Aug. 16, 2010

As my brother says: You get what you get and you don't throw a fit. (Damn my parents for giving him rhyming mantras)

barely rhymes.
some of the times.

never said I was one.

Well now that I think about it I will be a townie and be proud of it.
Embrace the worthlessness!

Posted at 8:08AM, Aug. 16, 2010

See, this exact attitude basically killed the morale in the last game. Ever single townie was whining about being able to do diddly squat, to the point where you just wanted to throw the game for the fun of it. Even Monkey, who I consider to be a serious gamer started off his involvement in the game by stating that he didn't care for playing the game, cause he got a lousy townie role.

The town could easily have won the game on multiple occasions if only they would have stood up and done something but the lack of interest turned it into a mafia victory. The game is not about having fancy powers that you can use to tip the scale into your favor. It's about doing your part in ensuring victory for your side. There's allot of things that townies can do that don't involve powers. Looking through and discussing the clues is among one thing but most importantly it's the backroom dealings that can turn the tide of the game. When players go around PQing each other, discussing "the plan", things can take a pretty unexpecting turns. Most importantly, your votes during lynches matters allot.

I've been a townie far more often then the cumulative times I've had a special role. Do I envy the players who get to go around and kill during the cover of darkness or go around doing background checks on everyone? Sure. I'll admit that as much. I've voiced my frustration about seeing Crocty getting a mafia role for the third time in a row. Does it mean I'm going to sit an wallow about, saying that I can't do anything and that I might as well not bother playing that game? No!

Frankly I'm getting sick and tired of this defeatist attitude, so pardon my rant.

Posted at 8:08AM, Aug. 16, 2010

Oh, dunno if that was aimed at anyone in particular, but just to clarify, I wasn't complaining for myself about the townie thing, I personally don't mind when I get townie, seeing as though I'm mafia like every time.

Just saying that like you said, there are many people who see the townies as worthless and just quit instantly. :\

Posted at 9:08AM, Aug. 16, 2010

It wasn't meant to be aimed at anyone specific but this does apply to many players who participated in the last game.

It is of course a common evolution of each game, where the mafia tends to pick out those who have a knack at rallying the town together or deciphering clues and in the end, you end up with only the inactive/quiet people. It's just the first time I've ever seen the game evolve into this much negativity. It's also the first time I couldn't wait to end one of my games.

Oh well. I wanted to see how the town would cope without a leadership and I guess I have my answer now.

Still… I'd like to point out a similar example of a game, where the mafia had all the cards in their hands and the town was sinking into a "voe is us" attitude. The mafia had managed to gain both the mayor and pardoner seat and had managed to kill off the vigilante, paramedics and detective. On the con side, they were also out of the mad hatter and the other hitman. The discussion at the time was essentially "Oh, well. We've already lost so we might as well not bother." Then Ochi stepped up and pepped everyone to stick it through so that the town could win. Her townie allegiance managed to win the game. Ochi eventually got killed though in the progress but by then the mafia was heading towards the loosing streak. Just because there's only townies left, doesn't mean that the game is over.

Posted at 8:08AM, Aug. 19, 2010

It wasn't meant to be aimed at anyone specific but this does apply to-

1337

I just didn't feel like solving clues (or attempting to) or anything. But I did try and get Niccea to confess her mafianess because it was pretty clear to me that she was.

It's easy with those players who are active in the forum but once mafia or some key player for the townies they do not come.

Posted at 9:08AM, Aug. 21, 2010

Well, I always blabber, as don, hitman, paramedic, ot townie. You never can tell what i am from level of inactivity! Except for the past week or so, when I was just off the site. I went to other places, did different things. It was a fun experience, but now I'm back!

Posted at 3:08PM, Aug. 22, 2010

Just as an FYI guys, Niccea is the official secretary super president of Mafia games from now on. Any disputes, issues and help concerning mafia games should be directed at her.

Posted at 9:08AM, Aug. 23, 2010

Well, I always blabber, as don, hitman, paramedic, ot townie. You never can tell what i am from level of inactivity! Except for the past week or so, when I was just off the site. I went to other places, did different things. It was a fun experience, but now I'm back!

No, I've predicted your role the past few games and been right most the time.

Posted at 10:08AM, Aug. 23, 2010

Yeah, Mett, you got to work on your poker face a little.

Posted at 11:08AM, Aug. 23, 2010

Puh-puh-puh-

-tatoes.

Posted at 9:08AM, Aug. 28, 2010

Poker face? I have a face?